Dealership Marketing

ALERT – DO NOT BUY LEADS from New Car America!

Jeff Kershner
Posted onAug 20, 2008 at 7:07 PM
Updated onUpdated on Oct 25, 2019 at 7:13 AM

5dollars_3

Be careful! Dealix is/was purchasing leads from a lead provider “New Car America” and it could be a scam.

My good friend and dealer owner brought this to my attention after speaking to a CUSTOMER (over the phone) that filled out the lead form. The phone conversation with the gentlemen that apparently filled out the lead form, supposedly confirmed that he was being paid to fill out leads request forms at $5.00 per form. The gentlemen went as far to say that he got the job by answering to a “work from home” ad.

  • I did a little research and found their actual website.

http://www.newcaramerica.com/

Taken from their “About Us” page.

“NewCarAmerica.com is committed to providing consumers direct access to automobile dealers across the United States. Our automobile directory helps our users quickly find dealers in their area. Thru the use of the latest technology, such as our new car quote service and daily Blog on topics effecting today’s car and truck buyers, we provide the fastest information available to help you buy your next car or truck.”

  • I did some more research and found their registration information.

Registration Service Provided By: BuffaloWeb Services, LLC

Visit: http://www.buffalowebhosting.com
Domain name: newcaramerica.com

Registrant Contact:
NewcarAmerica, Inc.
(I did remove the personal contact information)

  • Here is a copy of the lead from Dealix.

————————————–
DEALIX CORPORATION SALES LEAD
————————————–
Michael Hopkins has asked to be contacted specifically by your dealership regarding the 2008 Nissan Titan 4WD below. Please contact them as soon as possible.
————————————–
Lead No.:    1217054999
Received On: 8/3/2008 12:02:00 PM (PST)
————————————–
CUSTOMER INFORMATION:

Name:        Michael Hopkins
Address:     Valley View Ave
City:        Lewistown
State:       PA
Zip:         17044
Distance:    Customer is approx. 19.6961722717323 mi. from you
E-mail:      [email protected]
Phone:
Best Time:   Morning
Purchase Time Frame:  Within 2 weeks
————————————–
REQUESTED VEHICLE:

Year:         2008
Make:         Nissan
Model:        Titan 4WD
Trim:         XE Crew Cab Short Bed
Engine:       Not Specified
Transmission: Not Specified
Ext. Color:   No Preference
Int. Color:   No Preference
————————————–
ADDITIONAL INFO AND CUSTOMER NOTES:

No Trade-In Specified.
Payment Method: Cash
SPECIAL NOTES ON THIS LEAD:
Customer is approx. 19.7 mi. from you.
————————————–
CONTACT DEALIX:

Your Dealix Service Representative is:
Steve C. Diacont, 412-727-7857 (removed email)

It’s our goal to send you the very best sales leads in the business.
————————————–

After bringing this to Dealix’s attention, they did say they researched the lead and too called the customer to confirm that the gentlemen was indeed being paid to fill out the lead forms.

Props to Dealix for doing the research (I guess?) and for crediting the dealer for all the leads that had came from New Car America. It still concerns me that Dealix would even buy leads from a lead generator like this, just look at the website.

  • Here is a copy of the email from the support rep at Dealix (take notice to his signature..he.).

Hi Jeff,

These are the 4 leads that you received from New Car America, i have compd them.  I will stay on top of this and let you know when we have a resolution.

(see attached)

Thank You
Steve Diacont
Delaix
412-980-8377


This is total crap! I encourage EVERYONE that is purchasing leads from Dealix or ANY 3rd Party Lead provider to be sure you’re NOT careful buying leads from New Car America.

Jeff Kershner
Founder of DealerRefresh - 20+ Years of dealership Sales, Management, Training, Marketing and Leadership.
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Does anyone else find it funny that the guy's last name from Moran?
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That is one of the reasons I stopped buying 3rd party leads, I would say stop buying them all together and put all that money into name branding, if you do that you will sell more vehicles at a higher gross profit. Go ahead try it, dont be scared.
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    Jeff Kershner
  • August 20, 2008
Frank, overall I totally agree with you. If you do the "other stuff" right, removing 3rd party leads from your mix will not have an affect on your sales.
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Wow! Nice catch.
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    Bart Masciano
  • August 20, 2008
Third party "lead mills" involved in scamming????? Shocking!!!!
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    Gary Moran
  • August 20, 2008
Dear Readers,

This claim is ABSOLUTELY FALSE. We never told anyone we would pay them for a lead. We have never paid or claimed we would pay anyone for a lead. We have no "work from home" programs and we do not pay anyone for anything like that. We are a small blog site. We feel that this was mistaken identity. And what kind of site is this to defame someone's character and business - check the language, tone and the ridiculous five dollar bill at the top.

Sincerely

Gary Moran
CEO
New Car America Inc.
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"Distance: Customer is approx. 19.6961722717323 mi. from you"

19.6961722717323 mi.

That's accurate to 10trillionth of a mile.

That's like accurate down to a specific white blood cell of that lead.
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Jeff,

Do we need send our good friend Paul R. after these guys?

Eric

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    Jeff Kershner
  • August 20, 2008
Thanks for popping in Gary and for stating your case. We are all entitled to defend ourself.

" And what kind of site is this" - it's a community of dealers and internet sales managers that are sick and tired of the 3rd Party lead scam. Not saying they are all scams but this kind of stuff is happening all the time and there is no way of policing it other then calling it out when we catch it.

@Eric, i don't think we should do that. LOL
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    Gary Moran
  • August 20, 2008
Dear Readers,

The more I thought about it, the more inclined I am to speak to the veracity of this site and its claims.

Think about the math for this preposterous claim. Apparently Jeff Kershner hasn't. He states that his conversation "proved the provider (New Car America) was possibly paying people to fill out their leads request forms at $5.00 per form. New Car America apparently recruits employees with “work from home ads”."
Who in their right minds would pay someone $5.00 just to fill out a lead that may have already cost more in advertising fees than the less than $10.00 they likely would be paid to sell the lead. The margins are already pathetically small. Five dollars on top would mean the company was selling at a loss.

How do you "prove" something and then use the word "possibly"? You're proving a possibility? You can't prove a possibility. It wouldn't be a possibility if it could be proven. These words appear to smack of some kind of sabatoge launched against NCA.

Where are the "work from home" ads? Who else out there has ever filled out a lead from NCA and was written a check from us for $5.00? Who else out there am I paying to "work at home"? The answer is NO ONE. Jeff needed to find the facts before he attempted to destroy someone's business and reputation. There are laws against slander and libel. Show me an NCA check I wrote to someone?

The insult to my last name is childish and boring - I've heard it before as, I'm sure, has the family of the late Jim Moran, owners of the largest Toytoa dealership in the country.

The undignified language, unfounded and libelous accusations and the ludicrous and erroneous logic of this site speak for its innacuracy and invalidity.

Thank you, readers, for the opportunity to print a rebuttal. We will be watching closely for any other false and damaging claims made by this site.

Sincerely,

Gary Moran
CEO
New Car America
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Thanks for the heads up Jeff! Policing the scams that comes our way falls on us as the managers ALL THE TIME.

Owner: "What is this invoice for $999"

Internet Manager: "Let me look into it"

(intenet manager scrambling, wasting time to find if this is a legit claim or not)

Internet Manager 2 hours later: "Boss throw it away, its another bogus attempt to scam money from us"

Thanks again for the information Jeff,

Michael
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    CS
  • August 20, 2008
this is a pretty pointed attack with a total lack of evidence. i don't feel that a domain whois is much research.

you've outed this michael guy--are you encouraging each of your readers to contact him personally and ask a few questions?

gary has commented twice--he seems to be a guy willing to engage in dialog. someone brought up paul r, and i can't help but think about the dealerrefresh commenters agreeing that a simple phone call could have avoided a big stink just 2 or 3 weeks ago.

i digress. hey, here's a fact.

the dealerrefresh and newcaramerica websites were both started in late 2005. gary's first blog post wasn't until a few months after jeff's, but he was using his real name to sign each one just like his comments above. if he's scam, i don't know why.

no press is bad press, right?
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    Jeff Kershner
  • August 20, 2008
Thanks again for your comments and for your side of the story Gary. I appreciate you sharing.

It still doesn't explain why Dealix called the customer that filled out the lead and the end result was Dealix crediting the dealer for the leads coming from the lead service.

You are right about the sloppy use of wording with possibly and proved. I have made the changes.

Dealers get scammed on all the time and if it smells fishy, chances are it's fish.

If you like, feel free to give me a call tomorrow afternoon and we can discuss over the phone.


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    Jeff Kershner
  • August 21, 2008
@CS - there was more research then a mere whois look up but I appreciate your feedback. The Michael guy is the one that said that he was not even in the market for a car but was filling out the forms because he was getting paid to do it.

The 3rd party lead business has been on the verge of a scam for sometime now. Reselling customer leads to several dealers at a time then reselling the same leads months later. I've had it happen to me several times.

There's something fishy here. I'm not sorry for bringing it to the surface so other Internet sales managers and dealers are careful and not get stuck with bogus leads.

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Sounds like lead arbitrage sources not doing a good job of covering their tracks. It is very possible that someone is getting paid to fill out lead forms, not saying that New Car America is doing it.

In the affiliate world there is such a thing as "incentive" promotion. If you have got leads where people were trying to get a free Razor phone in the past they were funneled through an incentive site.

@Gary - If the lead houses are only paying you $10 a lead I suggest you get with some of the affiliate networks. I am being paid $12.50 per lead through one and $14 through another and do not have to worry about returns or bad press, justified or not.

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    Gary Moran
  • August 21, 2008
Dear Jeff,

To set the record straight, I told Dealix that we did not wish to be paid for this lead - it did come through our site.

I have no explanation for this, only conjecture. After reading your allegations, I wonder if this consumer was sent some kind of e-mail solicitation from someone else promising him that someone would pay him $5 for a lead. At that time, we had content on our site dealing with issues for people looking to trade-in for more fuel efficient cars during this oil crisis. That likely brought him to a web page where he confused our site with those who had sent him an incentive type e-mail. We have never had those kind of ads or e-mail enticements. I just don't know what is going on here. If the consumer said he wasn't even in the market, how else did this happen? I simply don't know.

We are just a small business This isn't my main living. I have no financial or other reasons to engage in this type of marketing activity. I started NCA as a hobby business and I have been upfront with all our accounts about this. I don't even have the staff to do the accounting necessary to pay people $5.00 per lead. We've done okay since late 2005. If we were engaging in this type of marketing practice, either paying people ourselves or sending them into a dealer who unknowingly was expected to pay them $5.00, we'd have been history in relatively short order. There was, nor is, no reason for us to try such a foolish and risky marketing strategy. Even if I needed the money that bad, that would be the last way to try to get it. Word travels fast, as we are seeing now.

I hate this type of thing as much as you do.

Thanks for the opportunity to clarify this issue. I have a long day(s) ahead of me.

Sincerely,

Gary Moran
NCA


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    Jeff Kershner
  • August 21, 2008
Gary, thanks again for stepping up to the plate to explain what you think could have possibly happened here.

I still invite you to call me if you have the time.

Jeff
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Let's be clear here: third-party lead providers have a place in your marketing efforts PROVIDED you have the processes and people in place to handle the leads. I sell between 30 to 50 vehicles a month from third-party leads. I don't believe you can arbitrarily place all of these providers under one heading either.

Gary appears to be a business person trying to do things the right way and I applaud him for contributing to the dialogue. I have access to hundreds of lead providers through wholesale exchanges, and Gary's company shows up in exactly none of them. This would lead me to believe he is actually generating his leads through his own efforts and not re-selling leads bought off an exchange.

I run both a car dealership AND a lead generation company. I am completely aware of the crap that is going on with many lead providers. I still purchase, on average, $15,000 in third party leads per month. I might not be the brightest guy on the planet, but at a $276 average cost per sale, this is a marketing effort I can't afford to not be in.

Again, all leads are not created equal. Unfortunately, you have to weed through a ton of bad providers to find the guys trying to do things the right way.

As always, my two cents...

Tom
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During my days at the Auto Group, I spent 2 months fully researching a good quality 3rd party lead provider & most of all a good local rep.

I had picked up Dealix as that initial 3rd party. To my luck they did very well for me, maybe it was my consistent follow up and not stop calling until they told me " STOP CALLING".

My closing ratio at the time was very well.

I never had a problem with getting credited back for them also. My rep was in the Detroit area and still to this day makes the time to come up here in Northern Michigan to visit. Actually he will be up here this weekend. Surprisingly again! He emailed me to hang out and chat!

It is hard to find a good rep from a good 3rd party lead provider that is more concerned about helping with the dealerships success than his paycheck!

Thanks Jason Porter @ Dealix!

Other than that, I speak highly of Dealix and it all comes down on how savvy the Internet Manager is on closing those appointments with a 3rd party lead!

There is my 2 sense .......



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This is all the more reason why dealerships should be focused on driving more traffic to their website and keeping it there. We know statistically that we will close more deals to website based customers. The question is, how do we attract a customer to submit a lead so we can get more leads? This is where RedNumbat does the trick. Visit www.rednumbat.com and check it out for yourselves.

Stan
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